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Kara Base Talk #2 - Polishing a Base
KYW Sprite
Created by Chief Grames / Consulted with akiyume

Published: Feb 08, 2016

Hi there base enthusiast, akiyume here :D
First off this will be a VERY Long Base Talk Series (wish it was a youtube video, but I don't do videos :P), so read this only if you have the time.

This is the second Kara War Base Talk Series, and the approach of this base is different than what I have done previously.  In my first explanation of Monica by Dreamz, I've explained how the finished product's positives, and approaches.  This time however I would like to explain an exchange of which how it is like to take a raw base design and turn it into a polished gem.  What I'm going to explain here is the process of which base designs have to think though and how much work and effort it takes to balance out the base compartment wise, and overall balance wise.  Some ideas I have suggested have been implemented, while some other ideas have been done on this base by Grames' own accordingly, so I'll indicate such changes, and everything described here is in linear fashion.

Of course the point of this particular Base Talk isn't to tell you "How epic this _____ base is", that would be appreciated, but the underlying messages such as trap balancing, 'scenario' patching, and as well as fixing any other things. This Base Talk will be more about the journey and how much tweaking a base needs to go balancing out the pro/cons of how attacks would come, and how much effort it takes for just to make a base correctly.

I'll try to explain the problems of the base itself, and then explain why this problem effects the overall balance of the whole base since the fact that compartments have their rules, and the overall bases also have their rules. Please enjoy the craft of base building.  Since this Base Talk is about the Journey, NOT the end result as much, I'll post the final product at the end.  I will also reference my TH9 War Base Considerations page.

 I would like to thank VERY much and credits to Chief Grames for allowing me to post this freshly, and not allowing this base to be months old before approval, he as the creator and me as the consultant as we both worked on this base. Like I've explained before, no one wants to share good base designs since that means the base loses it's value, but I truly thank Grames for allowing me to publish this base fresh, along side the tweaks, as the learning value such as this is something that is only shared in the closed chat environment and dies with the base.  This is a good opportunity to educate and learn from so I would like to thank him on behalf of the public, and my readers :D.  

P.S. What I've written below is me giving a full explanation of the details of the change.  Sometimes we just have to say a few words and us fellow base builders instantly understand, but this might not be the case for the public. So something that I wrote 4 paragraphs for below, can just be explained in 2 sentences between Base Builders because we understand the scenarios.  Hopefully with this Base Talk, it helps all those who inspire to be better base builders to understand the fundamentals of balance.

Version 1 - First Draft of KYW Sprite

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Here is the first draft presented to us in the Group, of his base design.  Looking at this base as it is, It's not bad at all from a normal perspective of base designing, traps are decently placed, the pathings work, as well as the fact that it looks balanced.

​ Here is where we as base builders think of when it comes to base attacking:

"central dgb is a nono, too easy to neutralize, and doesn't serve a purpose. Queen Walk can still get that south AD in that intersection." - akiyume

First Glimpse, First Problem: Diagonal Queen Walk Probably can Reach AD

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First off at this current meta (Feb 2016), Queen Walk is a really big threat for when it comes to how easy it is for them to exchange for almost no cost and damage.  You don't want them to be able to Queen Walk and be able to take any Air Defenses along the way as they go along your base.  

Looking at this base marked in green, you can see the fact there is a 4 tile distance between the edge of the wall, and the AD from the south-east side of the base (which is how you are suppose to build a base).  But if you look at it from the south side, you can see the fact that there is the intersection which makes it possible for the Queen to shot diagonally at the AD, and also the fact that from this diagonal angle, is actually 3 spaces from the AD, although we weren't sure if the Queen can reach that extra diagonal space or not, the possibility it can is highly likely so that needs to be changed.

TH9WBC: Anticipate A Queen Walk, Have 7 Tile Distance Compartments

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TH9 War Base Consideration Brief description: Queen Walk can reach defenses that are 3 tiles inside from the wall, and AD is a very important part of the base.  Allowing access to any ADs from Queen Walk is not a good exchange, so figuring out how much space is needed from the outside and inside is important.  There needs to be a 4 tile distance.

Second Problem: Central DGB

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Looking at this base you can see the fact that there is a centralized DGB.  The south side has alot of trap presence so they don't really need anymore traps, so the DGB needs to protect that right side. 

Right now the reason why DGB being central isn't effective is because of the fact for example, if the enemy's hogs come in from the east side (white arrows), the hogs would have taken almost all of the defenses that matter before they all go and die to the DGB.

If you look at where the DGB is being positioned, the DGB is literally right beside the Archer Queen, making it easy to 'bleed' and allow let's say the Golem/King to continue onto the base afterwards.  This Central Compartment is connected to way too many important compartments, so there is a super high risk of it being triggered coming from almost every direction therefore it being at this location does not contribute to the base at all.

Centralized Double Giant Bombs Are No Longer Effective

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Third Problem: Floating Springs vs Quick Hogs

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Here is another problem which is very common when it comes to building a base design.  Spring traps are specifically used to target hogs.  Looking at this image, you can see the fact that there are spring traps beside the Wall between the two defenses. There is a problem of how this triggers though: hogs move faster than spring traps.  The Reason why you see spring traps throwing away 3 hogs at a time, because most of the time, the hogs are already standing in front of the defenses, so the spring trap triggers THEN it springs the hogs. 
In this base's example, you can see the fact that if the Hogs travel from AD to the Wizard Tower, they will be faster than the 1. Triggers 2. Action sequence of the Spring Traps.  This set up will only work if there is a big pack of Hogs, where the front of the pack triggers the hogs, as they move along, and the middle/back end of the pack of hogs takes the hit.  Problem is, hogs now-a-days are Surgically entered, so there will only be a maximum of 4-6 hogs coming through.  If in this orange pathing comes along, the first 3-4 hogs in front will trigger both springs, then by-pass it, while just maybe 1-2 hogs get flinged.

Looking at it coming from the Xbow to the Wizard Tower (marked in black), since the fact that the Hogs will be in front of the wizards and standing on the springs the hogs will actually be maximized and 6 of the hogs will be all thrown out.  This is how to effectively use the springs.  But if the Pack of hogs continue onto from the Wiz to the AD, they'll trigger the Springs as they finish hopping over the wall, but they'll move quickly right past the AD.

Overall Problem with this 1.0 Version

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Now re-looking at this base again, in terms of the Groups, Sections, and Territories, the overall coverage of traps on the south west side of the base/that half of the base is relatively has the correct amount of traps.  But if you look at the right side of the base (black), you can see the fact that this 'zone' of amount of defenses are two groups, which within this zone, there is no traps through-out the two groups (white) therefore it's very vulnerable to being hogged without any consequences.  Like I've mention, the DGB in the center is too easily dismantle-able so that right side is extremely problematic since there is trap coverage..

Looking at the Red compartment, you can see the fact that if the hogs go from cannon to Tesla, the spring traps would work. But as I have mention in my "floating spring trap" problem, you can see the fact that the spring trap that leads from the cannon to other defenses, actually isn't in front of anything, therefore that left side spring trap won't activate properly.  Another problem with this compartment is the fact that you can see that if the hogs come in from the left side, they will follow the path of less resistance and be able to take out the AT>Tesla>AD and not trigger any spring traps. Coming from the south side, There is a DGB leading from AD to Wizard Tower, but that just isn't as effective since the fact that can be outhealed. The springs don't work, also the fact the in the green pathing, surgical hogs can by-pass the Springs not to mention they aren't properly set up.

Breaking News! Info on Current Meta (Feb 2016)

Just a small heads up to those that aren't as informed, that the meta has evolved from in the past 2 months since the December Updates.  Queen Walk is VERY high presence in the Elite War Clans, so you must not have any ADs be in reach of the Queen.  Another shift in meta is the fact that single spring traps aren't as effective anymore and the meta has shifted to double spring traps which can ruin more hogs at an early on stage, and even the fact there base right now that are running Spring Trap Farms.  

Tesla Farms are still viable but only work on first attacks if they aren't protected by traps, so although that is good for defending against first attacks, that is severely weakened during the second attack.  The aim for most Base Designers is of course build a base that can defend the first attack, but at the same time TWC bases try to make it so that the base is overall balanced even with the Traps being known.  Tesla farms are starting to be phased out, as they are starting to spread out.

Skeleton Traps are better being used in doubles in order to chip away at hogs.

Version 2 - KYW Sprite

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Looking at this image, you can see the fact that Gramer decided to move around the traps and a few defenses abit. The South side Air Defense has been fixed so that they can't Queen Walk from that location and get the AD>  The DGB at the core has now moved to the sides. While there is another set of DGB between the XBow/WizT. Overall compared to Version 1.0 of the base, this version has better working traps and in terms of the whole base, the trap location have covered the whole base, instead of allowing the right side to be empty.  The Central Core DGB is gone.  But looking at this base, this still didn't sit well with me as the traps aren't fully used properly.

The Central Springs would be too late and would serve no purpose.

West/South West Side Compartment Problem/Suggestion

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Now looking at this base again, I noticed a problem where was the fact that if the enemy killed the left side of the base, and then sent in Surgical Hogs from the Cannon and the Archer Tower.  They could potentially head straight forward to the defenses where the DGB are situated, since the fact that there isn't the Hourglass effect, it's a high possibility of this happening.

So with this suggestion, the West side compartment, wasn't fixed yet, so I suggested either move that tesla on the west side to where the Yellow area is, then place the double springs at the orange circle location, therefore allowing the springs to be more effective, as well as the fact that it could then make it so that hogs will instead of going from the Archer Tower to the Xbow, it'll go to the Tesla then to the Xbow.  The decision was up to Grames though since the fact that if he moves one Tesla to that location, it will forsure strengthen that side of the base, but also the fact that the Teslas will be in all within range of the Archer Queen if she does wall on the left side.  Having just one that will miniimize the amount of damage is done, and having that extra Tesla somewhere else would be maybe more beneficial on the long run.  

The problem of moving the Tesla to this location is the fact, is that it would be a direct line from the Archer Tower to the AD, instead of the previous AD>Tesla>AD/Cannon.  The good news about this set up is the fact that the Spring traps will work either direction.

South Side Problem/Consideration

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I gave the suggestion of either putting the Double Springs in front of the AD or putting double springs behind the AD.  Both of these positioning have their advantages and disadvantages.  You might think "why not just leave it as it is, with one in the front, one at the back?" Well, that could be useful but as I have explained before, the meta has moved from single spring traps to double spring traps.  With single springs, let's say the enemy used 8 hogs (4 by 4 surgical on the AT and the CAN), the pack would be able to go and kill the AT and the Cannon, afterwards head straight through to the AD.  At this point for example, if there was only 1 spring trap, that'll only fling a maximum of 3 hogs, leaving 5 hogs left. Considering the amount of DPS 5 hogs has, that's enough to take out the AD really quickly. Then head for the Tesla spot.  If there was double springs early on, or later on, that could totally mess with the timing of how fast the hogs kill the defense, and/or how long it takes for the hogs to beat down on the defense.  Rather than having 5 hit it every time, then 3, why not make it so that they lose it instantly so that only 2 survive to hit on the building?

Which is the reason why I have suggested to put either double springs in front of the Teslas or in front of the AD.  Both of these have their own advantages and disadvantages.  

Spring Traps In Front of AD:
Having the springs in front of the AD allows for the fact that hogs will be thrown away early on.  Problem is the fact that it lowers the strength if the hogs come from behind, as well as the fact that it needs the support of the Archer Tower and the Cannon to be there.  If they Queen Walk it and removed these two defenses. This set up allows for there not to be a pack of hogs to kill the AD too quickly.  

Spring Traps between AD/Tesla:
​If the Springs are between the Tesla and AD, that is a very unavoidable spring trap location, as well as the fact that it's is more internal, and unavoidable.  Even if the AT and the Cannon are killed, the Spring traps are still functional. 

East Side Zone Problem

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When it comes to the east side of the base, although now the presences of the DGB is there, it still isn't as effective to be honest.  Heals can still work over this, as well as the fact that there is alot of conflict between the different compartments and groups.

The conflict is the fact that you can see the fact that 4 of the defenses (cannon, wizardT, ArcherT, Cannon) are all within range of Queen Walk.  The defenses that mattered are the Xbow and AD, which serves as the primary layer of defenses, which leads inside (marked in black arrow) to the Wizard T and the Tesla.  Problem was that the fact a DGB would have been perfectly suited to be placed within these location, in terms of just the group interaction since the fact that the 4 other buildings mentioned are given to the enemy.  But remember what I have wrote at the beginning? The problem is the fact that a central DGB in that compartment is very easy to be bleeded upon since the fact that the Queen Compartment is very close to that core, and that core location has a high chance of being ground trooped.  So in the end, this location needs a DGB, or spring traps, but DGB at this location is hard to do.

Overall Base Looking

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Looking at the overall base, the left side needs to have the tesla moved along side the spring traps, so that it has a better pathing.  The South side would benefit more better with having a set of Double springs instead of single springs.  On the East side, there really is too much problem for when it comes to the placement of the traps.  The whole green area contains two primary groups, which lead to the central group at the core, but the fact is that there is almost no good location to put the DGB. Looking at the base as a whole though,  The most obvious locations (with some adjustment of course) would be in the core component, or beside the Xbow, to reinforce that south side more.  This set up though still doesn't sit well with me, so things had been shifted.

A New Approach for DGB Suggestion

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When I saw that top right side of the base, it reminded me of this setup which was purposed in a Base Building Chat with AL.  This was a diagonal DGB that will trigger if the Hogs come in from a linear direction, and I suggested to Grames to see if he wanted to use that in that top right section. The advantage of this type of set ups is the fact that it will allow for the DGB to exist at the right location, but since the fact that the DGB isn't all located at the core, there still will be that one GB in the other compartment.  So with this set up, in this base, it might actually be a surprisingly working DGB.

Version 3 - KYW Sprite

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Looking at this newer version of the base, you can see the fact Grames did what I've suggested with the Tesla on the left side, but surprisingly, he decided to make that "empty coreish area" into the new DGB location. The good thing about this now is the fact that even if the springs don't work, the DGB will work.  If the DGB don't work, the Springs will work.  Either way, that is a really balanced location on the east side, feinting a DGB that they think would be beside the xbow and wizardT but it isn't. 

Looking at the south side, you can see the fact that Grames opp-ed to use 4 of the spring traps at the south.  I think there might be some confusion when I showed him that image, but regardless, this set up is actually not bad at all tbh.  Since the south side has a very high presence and is almost the "direct opposite" of the Queen which almost makes it a very likely location for hogs to come to and from. The problem with such is the fact that now if you look at he compartment on the right side where the Xbow is, there is a really big location where it isn't protected by any traps.

Looking at the east side, Grames put the DGB at that location, which is fine tbh, but I am not liking that location of the DGB. Compare it to the mirror side where the Tesla and The DGB is, that side has a lower chance of ground troop coming in due to the fact that there is almost no value in that location, but at the east side, since there are 3 defenses, and 1 AD, that is already considered a 'medium' risk for which ground base troops can come through.  Looking at this base, You can see the fact that if they took out the core, and the east compartment.  The Xbow compartment is free range hogs, the south side compartment is actually abit iffy since the spring traps needs the hogs to come in from the south and the north, but if they already taken out the Archer Tower and the Cannon at the south, that is already 2 springs neutralized, leaving only one set of DGB, 2 springs, and 1 sorta springs left to work.  Problem with the left side DGB is the fact that is the "end game DGB" so if the hogs go through everything on the left side, then that last tesla might not be enough to defend against any loose troops.

Version 4 - KYW Sprite

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Now with Version 4 of the base, it's starting to look good, with the fact the fact that south side defenses are almost all covered by traps. 

This was going to be almost close to the final version of the base, but there was some problems/tweaks needed, and some choices which Grames had done which 


Tweak #1 DGB Conflict on the East Side

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Looking on the right side of the base where the DGB was, you can see the fact the hogs come in from the Cannon to the Xbow (through surgical), they will trip only one DGB at a time.  In order to fix this there was two options to do in order to make sure that the DGB would work.

Option #1 - Move the Cannon

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One option in order to make it is just move the problem, which is the Cannon and switch it with the Elixir Storage. Simple enough, and can be easily done to fix that hog movement, and make the Hourglass shape.
 The Con of doing this exchange is the fact the right side would only contain the Archer Tower, and the Xbow.  Just these two alone cannot negate a small pack of hogs, which can be used to suicide into the Xbow and pre-trigger the DGB.  The King would be the only defense against the Hogs as they are hitting against the Xbow, and that isn't a very good solution and the risk involve with this happen is too high of a risk to do, so I did not advise doing this switch.

Edit: Just noticed another option could be to just move the Cannon to the Dark Barrack location :P.

Option #2 - Move the DGB

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Second option, would be just move the DGB one spot to the right, which then if the hogs come in from the cannon to the Xbow, the back side giant bomb would trigger as well.  My opinion would be that this is a better option since the fact that it will work if the hogs come from the wizard tower, and it will work if the hogs come from the Cannon.  Only problem would be the fact that there is a slight chance that the DGB won't trigger correctly, also the fact that the coverage of the back side GB won't be able to kill the hogs that are coming in from the Archer Tower.

Tweak #2 - Traps at the North-east Compartment

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The east side isn't too much of a problem since the fact that there is a medium chance/risk of which Ground troops will come in from this location and be able to take out all the defenses here.  But if the enemy decided to go the opposite direction, then (as indicated by the orange arrows) hogs coming in from this direction will be able to completely take over this location.
The Tesla being at that location has a very high potential. 

Looking at the double springs beside the Xbow, that location isn't really as ideal for spring trap location and would be much better moved to his location.

Having this Tesla as it is right now, doesn't really allow it to be used for it's full potential since it's just a straight line for the hogs.

Option #1: Tesla beside the Queen

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For this option, you would have to move the AD one space to the right first.

For this option, there are pros and there are cons.  The pro is the fact that the tesla will be able to support the Queen's location, if there are any ground troops there.  It's a very good location since the fact that the tesla is also paired with the Wizard Tower.

The cons is the fact that if the hogs come in from the Archer Tower, it can disable the spring traps alot, as well as the fact that putting the Tesla closer to the Queen side makes it be alot more riskier for it to go down along side the Queen. 

Option #2: Tesla in the Middle

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For this option, having the tesla in this location actually feels alot better since the fact that the tesla would be able to support the Xbow (somewhat), as well as the fact that the pathing from the AT to the AD will still continue to effectively use the springs properly.  It's more isolated from the Queen Location, and completely works well with the double Wizard Towers.

Negative side of this is the fact that if they decided to Queen Walk the right side, this is something that would go down along with the compartment, as well as the fact that, it's not as supporting when it comes to the remainder of the base. 

Problem With Queen Compartment

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Now that we have fixed up almost everything in the compartments of the bases, I now started to look at the Archer Queen location. Looking at this part I noticed very big problems.  First is the fact that there is no coverage for when it comes to defending the storages.  Of course the Storages are meant to stall for time, which is given, but the problem is the fact that there is nothing to cover this location.  Placing one or two wizards at this location (along side the funnel wizard is the King) can easily take out the storages in less time than thought.  Another problem is the fact that once the funnel is gone, since there is no targeting defenses needed for any Golems at the north, a King would be able to come in from the north without even needing the Golem (if the BK is Lv20+), and be able to one shot the Queen.  Another problem is the fact that both Air Sweeper had been placed in with the Queen.  The Value of the AS being there is not a good idea since AS is better off protecting the compartment side against air troops, and having both of them go down at the same time with the Queen is not a good exchange.

Solution

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Not the best solution, but I proposed to exchange the Gold Storage with the Archer Tower, that way it can cover the north side abit.  Maybe just exchanging only one would be enough.  Having a mortar moved to protect the north side so that wizards won't be able to get through all of the storages, and also have the Archer Tower cover the Mortar just in case they wanted to minion the Mortar.  Moving at least one of the Air Sweeper out of the Queen Location would be a good idea as well. 

(In the final version), the Clan castle was moved into the Queen Compartment to make it even more difficult for the enemy to grab just the Queen.  The Clan Castle serves a better function protecting the Queen than it is being central and half contributing to the overall of the base.  I disagree with the Skeleton trap, and the double seeking being beside the Queen though.

Version 5 - Final Version of KYW Sprite

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Here is the end result of all the tweaking of the base.  Th Clan castle is now supporting the Queen.  The traps are in positioning and things are overall move balanced and well done compared to the early version of the base.  There is still things that do not sit well with me though... (explained in Version 6)

Post Final Version - Version 6 by aki

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This is the post-Final Version of TJW Sprite which I have just thought of when it comes to this base as I am completing this article.  

North Side;  I am still not liking the fact that there is that symmetrical Archer Tower, and there is nothing covering that north corner.  Exchanging the Archer Tower with that Gold Storage would be a better solution as well as the fact that moving that mortar up more, allows for the mortar to kill the wizards better.  Then you can move that east side mortar back south.  As you can see, the Air sweeper is more to the right side (to prevent suicide dragons), which is the reason why it's better to have the Seeking air mine moved to the left side.  The skeleton trap was there in order to distract the King, but I do not believe this is a good use of the skeleton trap, it is better off being pair with the other skeleton trap in order to chip away at hogs at the east side.

Air Sweeper: I have said that the central compartment is a really risky zone to be taken out, so having them both in that same compartment doesn't really sit well with me.  Moving it to that Xbow compartment (maybe not that location) but having it face west would make it alot better.

Seekings:  I disagree with the placement of the double seeking due to the fact that, like I've said, that middle compartment is too risky, and most of the Kill zone is located at the west and the south.  Moving the Seekings to the south is a better investment due to how much of a presence of being a kill zone there.  

For the east side, you can see the fact that there is 8 point defenses on the Air Defense, and putting a Seeking there is a must.  Putting double seekings there though puts too much of a 'weight' on the left side, which is not a good idea, but that top right seeking would be better off placed at this location as a better balance, and if there is the air sweeper facing this direction, then it's almost the best location to set up.

The Double Giant Bombs:  I don't think he took my advice for the Double Giant Bombs, but moving them one space to the right (for both of them) allows for the cannon to Xbow to trigger both DGB, and if for example the Hogs come in from the Xbow to the north Tesla, then they will still both trigger the DGB, just in case they managed to kill the AD the same time as the Xbow.

Conclusion

For those that have read everything. I applaud for you.  Although this page is the most wordiest page of what I have written so far, I believe this is the most educated page I have to offer when it comes to teaching how much of the importance of traps and tesla location is when it comes to the base design.  Just one tile movement can completely change how the base defends, and how the interaction of the base works.  When it comes to all this information, it only took us two as base builders, just less than 500 words, maybe 100 texts back and forth, and that's how you polish a base.  Just this base alone would take a few hours, but the process of correcting this base, took us about 2-3 hours back and forth.  Every minor change, even by one tile can completely change the outcome of the base, which is what I'm trying to show, the dynamics of how much effort it takes to create these bases.  Creating is one part, but polishing it is another.

This goes to show you how much a difference trap placement importance is for when it comes to a base design.  If you look at this base from Version 1, and compared it to Version 6, you can see how much of the fatal flaws for when it comes to hog pathing, Queen Killing, and everything it comes to for when it goes for the base.  Every compartment contributes to the base, and the balance of the base is very important.  Thank you for reading this, and I hope this educates you on the very complex but simple things that go along for when it comes to base design.
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